Certainly not meanly about it, hon--I think we were just managing to kinda both miss the other's point, hence causing confusion all around!
I guess Denzel just seems to be a bad example for your warnings against OCs/Mary Sues because, well, even though most people haven't watched the Complete version (or care to) because the initial release doesn't manage to patch together its already patchy plot well... but for me, the Complete release is the original version, because it was what was originally intended by the AC team, so when you discuss Denzel at all it's like, "You don't waste that much time, effort, and budget on a character who is completely unnecessary." I honestly don't think Nomura would have put him in there if he hadn't had some reason to... and it has to be a reason that could back up the money required to put Denzel into the movie.
Trust me, they were griping enough already over putting the symbolic!wolf in, they would have gladly left Denzel out if they hadn't known and already felt from the beginning that he was important somehow. It's not that they didn't do a horrible job with explaining his presence in the initial release--they did, but that was a problem of deadline, not necessarily a fault of the storytellers.
Which I guess is probably what bothers me so much about this--it's a problem of deadlines and stupid company decisions, not a problem with the storytellers. (And they even tried to make up for it by making Denzel's story available online--of course, only in Japanese for the longest time--so fans in Japan could actually read more about him and get a better sense of his character and what got left out of the initial release of the film.)
(...speaking of which, don't bother reading the English translation, as it's horrible. We had you watch the Complete version of the film, and that's all you really need to know. XD)
It's kinda the flip-side of what went on with Rowling and the last set of Harry Potter books, where the character of Tonks (and others) made no sense and it was largely a fault of 1) Rowling's inexperience, which, while charming at times, also leads to obvious faults, and 2) her editors being too scared to cross her and actually call her out on the obvious problems with her storytelling.
I mean, one could say that it was a problem with deadlines for her, too, but I would say that's bullshit. The world could honestly have waited a few more years for the story to mature and get cleaned up, and Rowling should have known that she would need to allow for good editing time before unleashing her project on the world. The publishing company wouldn't have pressured her so much if she hadn't let them--the added anticipation might have just made them more money, after all.
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timeasmymeasure
no subject
Date: 2010-05-24 03:41 pm (UTC)I guess Denzel just seems to be a bad example for your warnings against OCs/Mary Sues because, well, even though most people haven't watched the Complete version (or care to) because the initial release doesn't manage to patch together its already patchy plot well... but for me, the Complete release is the original version, because it was what was originally intended by the AC team, so when you discuss Denzel at all it's like, "You don't waste that much time, effort, and budget on a character who is completely unnecessary." I honestly don't think Nomura would have put him in there if he hadn't had some reason to... and it has to be a reason that could back up the money required to put Denzel into the movie.
Trust me, they were griping enough already over putting the symbolic!wolf in, they would have gladly left Denzel out if they hadn't known and already felt from the beginning that he was important somehow. It's not that they didn't do a horrible job with explaining his presence in the initial release--they did, but that was a problem of deadline, not necessarily a fault of the storytellers.
Which I guess is probably what bothers me so much about this--it's a problem of deadlines and stupid company decisions, not a problem with the storytellers. (And they even tried to make up for it by making Denzel's story available online--of course, only in Japanese for the longest time--so fans in Japan could actually read more about him and get a better sense of his character and what got left out of the initial release of the film.)
(...speaking of which, don't bother reading the English translation, as it's horrible. We had you watch the Complete version of the film, and that's all you really need to know. XD)
It's kinda the flip-side of what went on with Rowling and the last set of Harry Potter books, where the character of Tonks (and others) made no sense and it was largely a fault of 1) Rowling's inexperience, which, while charming at times, also leads to obvious faults, and 2) her editors being too scared to cross her and actually call her out on the obvious problems with her storytelling.
I mean, one could say that it was a problem with deadlines for her, too, but I would say that's bullshit. The world could honestly have waited a few more years for the story to mature and get cleaned up, and Rowling should have known that she would need to allow for good editing time before unleashing her project on the world. The publishing company wouldn't have pressured her so much if she hadn't let them--the added anticipation might have just made them more money, after all.